While I am open to Unz's hypothesis about obesity+COVID and think there may be some truth to it, I also see a few "holes" in it, and it certainly doesn't disprove that the mRNA vaccines are killing people. For one thing, Unz has limited his analysis to "working-age mortality", and the evidence suggests that this would miss most vaccine deaths. Why? Because contrary to popular belief, most evidence suggests that the majority of the people killed by the vaccine are actually OLDER people.
First of all, the excess vaccine deaths in the Pfizer and Moderna "gold standard" randomized clinical trials (the highest quality evidence that exists, period) were confined to the OLDER age groups. The younger age groups had no excess deaths in the trials (of course they exist, just much more rare than in older). In the older age groups, the two clinical trials combined had a total of 21 deaths in the vaccine groups versus 16 deaths in the placebo groups.
Among the older age group (>55) in the Pfizer clinical trial, there were 12 deaths in the vaccine group versus 10 deaths in the placebo group. Consistent trend but 20% increase here- if they divided at age 65 like Moderna maybe the increase would be larger, who knows. https://www.fda.gov/media/152256/download - see page 57, BOTTOM of Table 25
Finally, in VAERS, over 70% of unexpected post-vaccine deaths with known ages were in people aged >65 (and about 90% with known ages were in people over age 50). https://openvaers.com/covid-data/mortality
Anecdotally, all 3 people I know who died unexpectedly a few months after vaccination were in the 60-80 age range, and a fourth in his early 80s (healthy) almost died of a sudden cardiovascular event. NONE of them were obese or even overweight, and only one had had COVID (mild case pre-vax).
I agree completely. It is not that the jabs are not affecting older adults it is just soo much easier to sweep the deaths of older people under the rug. Because I follow demographic trends and I have been vaccine skeptical for a few decades I was following the CDC all cause mortality dashboard on the jab rollout. My first big red flag was a HUGE uptick in both all cause and Covid mortality in January of 2021 in the oldest age groups, which coincided clearly with age stratified jab rollout at the time. This signal was less obvious in younger cohorts as some healthcare workers got the jabs right away, some got it when available for their age, and others held off until mandates or some other reason coerced them (eg family emergency forces travel somewhere with jab mandate). The vaccinators doubled down on evidence of the massacre by claiming this big wave was the reason the rollouts needed to go even faster. All signs pointed to the jabs as fueling both the death and the Covid outbreak. I concluded based on this that not only were these vaccines ineffective, but they looked like the worst in history on safety to boot. I'm not disputing a link between obesity and mortality. I don't understand why that should conclusively end a debate on vaccine safety...
Hi Amy, this is the first I've heard of you. I came over from the link you posted on Steve Kirsch's substack. I've just read the comments here and I'm so sorry to learn of the predicament your family is in.
You ask "Does anyone else want to take on this guy?" Sorry, I'm not clear whether you yourself have been trying to take him on. I haven't seen you over on his site at https://www.unz.com/, but that may be because you're there under a pseudonym. Also, there are so many commenters there that I do not take the time to pay much attention to everyone. Anyway, if you haven't been taking him on yourself I would encourage you to do so, though as nymusicdaily says he may not be worth engaging. See my reply to him.
No worries. I am so glad the Chinese New Year is early on January 22. It's usually in February but falls on the second new moon after the winter solstice. Thailand is going crazy and my husband is getting very worried. To summarize: he can't get here (without the Covid jabs) and I can't currently get there (without Covid jabs). I spent two years separated from my older daughter over this shit, had a period of 2021 and early 2022 where I could not leave the province of Phuket, much less Thailand, unless I had no plan to ever come back, and my income has been cut to 1/4 to 1/5 of what it was before Covid. I've been put in a situation of misery personally, financially, in every way that I could be over this bullshit. If it hadn't been for substack I think I would have lost my mind. 2021 was my worst year in every way it could be.. I never cared about politics and just wanted to be left alone with my own little version of happy. All I have is my health and my family. So to call me pissed would be a slight understatement.
you'll get a great book out of this - if you can handle looking back when this is all over. have been wondering myself about that. and you've been through way worse than me.
what if your husband could get through via mexico? does he speak any spanish?
My husband doesn't but I habla poquito. I was having a conversation with my friend Pete about that all on New Year's Eve: he's originally from Nicaragua and despite serving in the USMC, stationed in Thailand, he is still here on a 10 year green card after all of these decades. Everybody mentions Mexico but the problem is my husband needs a visa to get there, and why is he going there, again? The closest visa exempt countries for Thai passport holders are El Salvadore and Cuba. I don't have anyone on the ground in either place, which makes me nervous. I would only do this as a very public like live streamed display of the utter corruption of US immigration policy
too bad michael moore has been compromised. he'd be the perfect director. he loves cuba.
when i was solvent enough to be plotting an escape, i looked seriously at nicaragua, who never really locked down. trouble with those places is that US deep state can destabilize them. like, fast.
honduras visa to darien gap where michael yon is reporting, to the soros bus north? desperate times...
There's high crime levels to deal with and it is near impossible for our family to not stick out everywhere we go. I kinda wish Pete had kept up with his family in Managua but he's got too much of a crush on me and I'm not interested in that game. I'm assuming Michael Moore is psychotically pro vax. Havana here we come!
I don't know about anyone else, but I'd like to tread an article about all of this. Expose the ridiculousness of the policies and how they're harming families.
yeah i have yet to meet someone from that part of the world who wants to go back. there must be really awful video on michael m because he came out as a total jab lunatic. a cartoon. maybe that was intentional.
as long as venezuela is solvent, cuba will be too...hmmmm...at least there is coastline and fish...
All due respect to Steve, he isn’t the best debater. But the sheer weight of evidence is on his side. So he would win. Is it worth it? Probably not. I hate to advocate guns and violence but they’ve always worked for me. RIP HST.
at the risk of outing myself as a chaos agent, ron unz is either controlled op or just plain crazy and has a long track record to back that up. not worth engaging, imo.
other than igor, joel smalley (imagine you are already a subscriber) is the man on excess mortality - and somehow manages to retain a sense of humor https://metatron.substack.com
I do read metatron. Sometimes Joel Smalley is absolutely on point, sometimes I can tell he's still trying to make sense of something he sees in the data too!
As for controlled op/plain crazy/just ignore, the recent Thailand reinstitutes vax pass debacle has me in more of a fighting mood than usual. I've long seen people who simply sound delusional from my perspective and I usually do ignore them. I'm tired of them holding the high ground. Their numbers are bullshit and I want the criminals out over this whole debacle. No echo chamber. Sometimes the best defense is a good offense.
can only imagine how unbelievably messed up this must be for you Amy. does the princess have to die first to get the ball rolling? are you vegas-based til further notice?
I'm still trying to get back. I can't seem to schedule to get my younger daughter a new US passport none of the post offices in Las Vegas have any availability for the next four weeks on passport processing. Nicolas Creed got back to Thailand with his wife, but it was a lot of crazy flux. Thailand seems to be walking it back as some weird temporary measure through January 31 and it has caused a lot of chaos in the travel sector. Meanwhile I've found a few people on twitter who are in my same and opposite situation: to wit, my husband's visa to the USA is going nowhere and the USA just extended its jab mandate on foreigners. I'm on both sides of this one but I need a lot of support. And I'm pissed
A few people have posted links from the Phuket News and other places. Let me see if I have the official announcement somewhere perhaps Nick Creed posted it. The procedure sounds a lot in flux still but is a classic example of Thailand shooting itself in the foot.
I think a lot of people have a similar take on Ron Unz. I myself have no confidence that Ron will change his view that the virus as opposed to the injection is a key cause of death. However, does that make him not worth engaging? It's a practical question for me because I've been in an exchange with him, and I am wondering whether to continue. Even if Ron won't change, the question is whether something will come out of it that is worthwhile in terms of his audience, or even in terms of what I myself might learn by continuing. Any thoughts?
I have been engaging in a debate with our roommate in Las Vegas. He is a 70 year old man, quintuple jabbed for Covid (along with flu or shingles or whatever else). The guy is a true true believer. I happen to know his health is terrible and in decline with each successive jab: he's in doctor's offices at least once a week and just had a heart attack on December 28. From my vantage point this is so clearly tied to all these jabs he's taking. Yet even now he credits doctors. He says his father and brothers all died of heart attacks in their 50's and 60's, so his 95% aortic occlussion was heredity, bad genes and in no way tied to all of his vaccines. I have realized at some point that I might not ever be able to convince him that the jabs are bad. But for a wider, impartial audience, watching the debate from the outside, I might be able to get them to think.
I appreciate your cumulative all cause mortality graph but it doesn't jive well with my smooth brain, I like things simpler. What do you think of a simple 6 year quarterly dot plot:
The level of the countries obese people would have remained relatively constant over the last ten years as an example. So if excess deaths happened in the last 3 years you have to look at something other than the basic fact that they are obese to explain the excess . 2020 could be explained by COVID, but what about 2021 and 2022. The vaccine should have reduced the excess if COVID was the cause, so what happened in 2021 and 2022 that was different? The vaccine itself. In fact in England 2022 had far more excess deaths than in 2020.
Well, at least half of covid deaths were actually iatrogenocide, so there's that. And if excess deaths are still way up despite hardly anyone dying from covid in the second half of 2022? Unz also seems to ignore the admission from CDC/Phizer et al the myo and pericarditis is an issue. Unz readers too are not going to accept any opinion from Mr Unz other than the vaccines are benign, so I expect him to be categorically blind in that regard.
That said, I'm not sure Kirsch is going to be the best debater.
Thank you, Amy. These are two bright guys, both unconventional, willing to shine light in dark corners. Exactly what we need. We should not be supporting any specific narrative, just the fact that the truth should have a chance to come out.
Once you start playing their game you're done. You cannot win this argument if you're dumb enough to believe in such things as a specific killer virus that is responsible for a specific disease. Their "proof" is the result of computer simulations. If you accept that they will run rings around you. They will not permit any questioning of their sacred theories.
Imagine if Dr.s. Sam and Mark Bailey's incisive proposal to settle the virus debate was ever implemented. Then I believe it would become quite apparent that people would finally realize the Emperor Has No Clothes. https://drsambailey.com/resources/settling-the-virus-debate/
Why debate anyone....Pfizer tried to suppress data for 75 years and now has had to release it with scathing data....over 1300 side effects listed....case closed......
I disagree though. They need enforcers to enforce anything and that requires at least a gleaming sheen of lipstick on this pig. So they generate some bullshit data that says 20 million were saved by the jabs or all the deaths are because Americans are fat or whatever and hope their jabbed complacent population goes back to sleep while they try to roll out Martial law in advance of collapse. Well who is enforcing the law? Challenge them everywhere you can, vocally and loudly. Your life might depend on not slinking into the night under some name calling...
I hope you are right.....but there are a lot of things in that document that says it overrides votes or consent from foreign governments.....
"The International Health Regulations are existing, legally-binding international law. If the proposed amendments are presented to the 76th World Health Assembly, they could be adopted by a simple majority of the 194 member nations. According to the already agreed upon rules of the IHR, if the proposed amendments are adopted, the member nations would not need to take any additional actions.
The United States Senate would not be required to provide a two-thirds vote to give their “advice and consent.” No signatures by national leaders would be needed."
I'll read his take on it too. To me somebody picked up the phone and made a few calls and the whole effing world stopped in 2020. I don't think it will be that easy to do it again if people stop enforcing and stop going along and stop being slaves to it. That's my broad take but I hope it doesn't pass regardless
While I am open to Unz's hypothesis about obesity+COVID and think there may be some truth to it, I also see a few "holes" in it, and it certainly doesn't disprove that the mRNA vaccines are killing people. For one thing, Unz has limited his analysis to "working-age mortality", and the evidence suggests that this would miss most vaccine deaths. Why? Because contrary to popular belief, most evidence suggests that the majority of the people killed by the vaccine are actually OLDER people.
First of all, the excess vaccine deaths in the Pfizer and Moderna "gold standard" randomized clinical trials (the highest quality evidence that exists, period) were confined to the OLDER age groups. The younger age groups had no excess deaths in the trials (of course they exist, just much more rare than in older). In the older age groups, the two clinical trials combined had a total of 21 deaths in the vaccine groups versus 16 deaths in the placebo groups.
Among the older age group (>65) in the Moderna clinical trial, there were 9 deaths in the vaccine group versus 6 deaths in the placebo group. Small numbers, but that's a 50% increase in deaths. https://www.nejm.org/doi/suppl/10.1056/NEJMoa2113017/suppl_file/nejmoa2113017_appendix.pdf - see page 53, Table S19
Among the older age group (>55) in the Pfizer clinical trial, there were 12 deaths in the vaccine group versus 10 deaths in the placebo group. Consistent trend but 20% increase here- if they divided at age 65 like Moderna maybe the increase would be larger, who knows. https://www.fda.gov/media/152256/download - see page 57, BOTTOM of Table 25
Finally, in VAERS, over 70% of unexpected post-vaccine deaths with known ages were in people aged >65 (and about 90% with known ages were in people over age 50). https://openvaers.com/covid-data/mortality
Anecdotally, all 3 people I know who died unexpectedly a few months after vaccination were in the 60-80 age range, and a fourth in his early 80s (healthy) almost died of a sudden cardiovascular event. NONE of them were obese or even overweight, and only one had had COVID (mild case pre-vax).
I agree completely. It is not that the jabs are not affecting older adults it is just soo much easier to sweep the deaths of older people under the rug. Because I follow demographic trends and I have been vaccine skeptical for a few decades I was following the CDC all cause mortality dashboard on the jab rollout. My first big red flag was a HUGE uptick in both all cause and Covid mortality in January of 2021 in the oldest age groups, which coincided clearly with age stratified jab rollout at the time. This signal was less obvious in younger cohorts as some healthcare workers got the jabs right away, some got it when available for their age, and others held off until mandates or some other reason coerced them (eg family emergency forces travel somewhere with jab mandate). The vaccinators doubled down on evidence of the massacre by claiming this big wave was the reason the rollouts needed to go even faster. All signs pointed to the jabs as fueling both the death and the Covid outbreak. I concluded based on this that not only were these vaccines ineffective, but they looked like the worst in history on safety to boot. I'm not disputing a link between obesity and mortality. I don't understand why that should conclusively end a debate on vaccine safety...
Hi Amy, this is the first I've heard of you. I came over from the link you posted on Steve Kirsch's substack. I've just read the comments here and I'm so sorry to learn of the predicament your family is in.
You ask "Does anyone else want to take on this guy?" Sorry, I'm not clear whether you yourself have been trying to take him on. I haven't seen you over on his site at https://www.unz.com/, but that may be because you're there under a pseudonym. Also, there are so many commenters there that I do not take the time to pay much attention to everyone. Anyway, if you haven't been taking him on yourself I would encourage you to do so, though as nymusicdaily says he may not be worth engaging. See my reply to him.
so you can't get there and he can't get here? that is pathologically evil.
have been reading that the thai mandate is to scare off the chinese and may end when the new year celebration is over.
thinking metaphorically here (although pricetag could be prohibitive): a whale turns into a dolphin turns into a seal on the beach and...
go ahead and delete this if needs be
No worries. I am so glad the Chinese New Year is early on January 22. It's usually in February but falls on the second new moon after the winter solstice. Thailand is going crazy and my husband is getting very worried. To summarize: he can't get here (without the Covid jabs) and I can't currently get there (without Covid jabs). I spent two years separated from my older daughter over this shit, had a period of 2021 and early 2022 where I could not leave the province of Phuket, much less Thailand, unless I had no plan to ever come back, and my income has been cut to 1/4 to 1/5 of what it was before Covid. I've been put in a situation of misery personally, financially, in every way that I could be over this bullshit. If it hadn't been for substack I think I would have lost my mind. 2021 was my worst year in every way it could be.. I never cared about politics and just wanted to be left alone with my own little version of happy. All I have is my health and my family. So to call me pissed would be a slight understatement.
Did they cancel the vaxx requirement?
https://www.thephuketnews.com/covid-vaccination-entry-requirements-scrapped-86819.php
Or do they only plan to cancel it? It's been very confusing.
I had to go to Vietnam last week due to my visa, and it was amazing to me how much more relaxed they were about Covid. Almost no one had masks.
It's 99% masked where I'm at and I think it makes society crazy and stressed. You don't get the casual smiles and friendliness from people anymore
you'll get a great book out of this - if you can handle looking back when this is all over. have been wondering myself about that. and you've been through way worse than me.
what if your husband could get through via mexico? does he speak any spanish?
My husband doesn't but I habla poquito. I was having a conversation with my friend Pete about that all on New Year's Eve: he's originally from Nicaragua and despite serving in the USMC, stationed in Thailand, he is still here on a 10 year green card after all of these decades. Everybody mentions Mexico but the problem is my husband needs a visa to get there, and why is he going there, again? The closest visa exempt countries for Thai passport holders are El Salvadore and Cuba. I don't have anyone on the ground in either place, which makes me nervous. I would only do this as a very public like live streamed display of the utter corruption of US immigration policy
too bad michael moore has been compromised. he'd be the perfect director. he loves cuba.
when i was solvent enough to be plotting an escape, i looked seriously at nicaragua, who never really locked down. trouble with those places is that US deep state can destabilize them. like, fast.
honduras visa to darien gap where michael yon is reporting, to the soros bus north? desperate times...
There's high crime levels to deal with and it is near impossible for our family to not stick out everywhere we go. I kinda wish Pete had kept up with his family in Managua but he's got too much of a crush on me and I'm not interested in that game. I'm assuming Michael Moore is psychotically pro vax. Havana here we come!
I don't know about anyone else, but I'd like to tread an article about all of this. Expose the ridiculousness of the policies and how they're harming families.
yeah i have yet to meet someone from that part of the world who wants to go back. there must be really awful video on michael m because he came out as a total jab lunatic. a cartoon. maybe that was intentional.
as long as venezuela is solvent, cuba will be too...hmmmm...at least there is coastline and fish...
All due respect to Steve, he isn’t the best debater. But the sheer weight of evidence is on his side. So he would win. Is it worth it? Probably not. I hate to advocate guns and violence but they’ve always worked for me. RIP HST.
at the risk of outing myself as a chaos agent, ron unz is either controlled op or just plain crazy and has a long track record to back that up. not worth engaging, imo.
other than igor, joel smalley (imagine you are already a subscriber) is the man on excess mortality - and somehow manages to retain a sense of humor https://metatron.substack.com
I do read metatron. Sometimes Joel Smalley is absolutely on point, sometimes I can tell he's still trying to make sense of something he sees in the data too!
As for controlled op/plain crazy/just ignore, the recent Thailand reinstitutes vax pass debacle has me in more of a fighting mood than usual. I've long seen people who simply sound delusional from my perspective and I usually do ignore them. I'm tired of them holding the high ground. Their numbers are bullshit and I want the criminals out over this whole debacle. No echo chamber. Sometimes the best defense is a good offense.
can only imagine how unbelievably messed up this must be for you Amy. does the princess have to die first to get the ball rolling? are you vegas-based til further notice?
I'm still trying to get back. I can't seem to schedule to get my younger daughter a new US passport none of the post offices in Las Vegas have any availability for the next four weeks on passport processing. Nicolas Creed got back to Thailand with his wife, but it was a lot of crazy flux. Thailand seems to be walking it back as some weird temporary measure through January 31 and it has caused a lot of chaos in the travel sector. Meanwhile I've found a few people on twitter who are in my same and opposite situation: to wit, my husband's visa to the USA is going nowhere and the USA just extended its jab mandate on foreigners. I'm on both sides of this one but I need a lot of support. And I'm pissed
You have a link to the latest Walkback on Thai Entry requirements?
I found this link: https://www.channelnewsasia.com/asia/thailand-removes-entry-requirement-proof-covid-19-vaccination-3192236
They u turn and brake and stop so fast there that it can give you whiplash...
A few people have posted links from the Phuket News and other places. Let me see if I have the official announcement somewhere perhaps Nick Creed posted it. The procedure sounds a lot in flux still but is a classic example of Thailand shooting itself in the foot.
Go through your congressional rep for passport assistance.
I think a lot of people have a similar take on Ron Unz. I myself have no confidence that Ron will change his view that the virus as opposed to the injection is a key cause of death. However, does that make him not worth engaging? It's a practical question for me because I've been in an exchange with him, and I am wondering whether to continue. Even if Ron won't change, the question is whether something will come out of it that is worthwhile in terms of his audience, or even in terms of what I myself might learn by continuing. Any thoughts?
I have been engaging in a debate with our roommate in Las Vegas. He is a 70 year old man, quintuple jabbed for Covid (along with flu or shingles or whatever else). The guy is a true true believer. I happen to know his health is terrible and in decline with each successive jab: he's in doctor's offices at least once a week and just had a heart attack on December 28. From my vantage point this is so clearly tied to all these jabs he's taking. Yet even now he credits doctors. He says his father and brothers all died of heart attacks in their 50's and 60's, so his 95% aortic occlussion was heredity, bad genes and in no way tied to all of his vaccines. I have realized at some point that I might not ever be able to convince him that the jabs are bad. But for a wider, impartial audience, watching the debate from the outside, I might be able to get them to think.
I appreciate your cumulative all cause mortality graph but it doesn't jive well with my smooth brain, I like things simpler. What do you think of a simple 6 year quarterly dot plot:
https://spud1984.substack.com/p/looking-for-excess-deaths-among-young
I think humans are great at pattern recognition, and prefer raw data over massaged.
The level of the countries obese people would have remained relatively constant over the last ten years as an example. So if excess deaths happened in the last 3 years you have to look at something other than the basic fact that they are obese to explain the excess . 2020 could be explained by COVID, but what about 2021 and 2022. The vaccine should have reduced the excess if COVID was the cause, so what happened in 2021 and 2022 that was different? The vaccine itself. In fact in England 2022 had far more excess deaths than in 2020.
Well, at least half of covid deaths were actually iatrogenocide, so there's that. And if excess deaths are still way up despite hardly anyone dying from covid in the second half of 2022? Unz also seems to ignore the admission from CDC/Phizer et al the myo and pericarditis is an issue. Unz readers too are not going to accept any opinion from Mr Unz other than the vaccines are benign, so I expect him to be categorically blind in that regard.
That said, I'm not sure Kirsch is going to be the best debater.
Thank you, Amy. These are two bright guys, both unconventional, willing to shine light in dark corners. Exactly what we need. We should not be supporting any specific narrative, just the fact that the truth should have a chance to come out.
It's long past time to engage all sides...
Once you start playing their game you're done. You cannot win this argument if you're dumb enough to believe in such things as a specific killer virus that is responsible for a specific disease. Their "proof" is the result of computer simulations. If you accept that they will run rings around you. They will not permit any questioning of their sacred theories.
Imagine if Dr.s. Sam and Mark Bailey's incisive proposal to settle the virus debate was ever implemented. Then I believe it would become quite apparent that people would finally realize the Emperor Has No Clothes. https://drsambailey.com/resources/settling-the-virus-debate/
Why debate anyone....Pfizer tried to suppress data for 75 years and now has had to release it with scathing data....over 1300 side effects listed....case closed......
Also, this is why they are not letting up.....they don't have to....we are in BIG trouble..... https://gettr.com/post/p24n3h18d2c
I disagree though. They need enforcers to enforce anything and that requires at least a gleaming sheen of lipstick on this pig. So they generate some bullshit data that says 20 million were saved by the jabs or all the deaths are because Americans are fat or whatever and hope their jabbed complacent population goes back to sleep while they try to roll out Martial law in advance of collapse. Well who is enforcing the law? Challenge them everywhere you can, vocally and loudly. Your life might depend on not slinking into the night under some name calling...
I hope you are right.....but there are a lot of things in that document that says it overrides votes or consent from foreign governments.....
"The International Health Regulations are existing, legally-binding international law. If the proposed amendments are presented to the 76th World Health Assembly, they could be adopted by a simple majority of the 194 member nations. According to the already agreed upon rules of the IHR, if the proposed amendments are adopted, the member nations would not need to take any additional actions.
The United States Senate would not be required to provide a two-thirds vote to give their “advice and consent.” No signatures by national leaders would be needed."
I am not American but assume that Canada would be affected the same way.....I am not as optimistic....James Roguski is really fighting hard against this, as well..... https://jamesroguski.substack.com/p/secret-meetings?utm_source=post-email-title&publication_id=746475&post_id=95745107&isFreemail=true&utm_medium=email
I'll read his take on it too. To me somebody picked up the phone and made a few calls and the whole effing world stopped in 2020. I don't think it will be that easy to do it again if people stop enforcing and stop going along and stop being slaves to it. That's my broad take but I hope it doesn't pass regardless